#83 - Michael Sainz Takes Over The Show To Talk ADCC Trials

Speaker 1: What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to the Flow Grappling show. Before I bring the rest of the boys in, I just wanted to talk to you guys one-on-one real quick about what we're about to do, all right? We're going to be bringing on Michael Saines. And I got a little prank plan for him, all right? We're going to prank him off the rip, get him on his heels, you know, get him out of his comfort zone, see what we can do to shake him up a little bit. And then hopefully, we're going to get just the whole Saines family coming on crashing the show. We're going to talk to the, you know, Mama Saines, Caio, Tristan, all these people. So, very exciting show. A little chaotic one, so I hope you guys enjoy it. But while I still got you guys here, I want to tell you a little secret. A little secret about Merrick Health. The Flow Grappling show is brought to you by Merrick Health, helping athletes optimize hormones, improve recovery, and maximize performance through precision, lab testing, and expert medical oversight. You can use code Flow now for 10% off both Merrick Diagnostics and Merrick Health at Merrickhealth.com/flowgrappling. So go over there, get you some Merrick Health. And like I said, that's a little secret, so don't don't go spreading that everywhere. That's between me and you. That's a little deal I worked out for for just us here listening to this now. I'm going to get my blood drawn on Wednesday. I talked to my health specialist. He told me that based on my diet, I probably have high cholesterol. So I'm going to have to get that figured out so I can keep doing this for you guys for a long, long time. But I'll handle that on my end. You guys just sit back and enjoy the rest of the show. Speaker 2: What's up, everybody? Welcome back to the Flow Grappling show, aka the worst show on the internet. As always, I'm Trey Robinson. We got Big Uncle Reed right there. Joey Scoops right there. And we got a very special guest calling in. This is not just one of the best grapplers of his generation, one of the best grapplers of any generations, one of the youngest rising stars, one of the best grapplers I've ever seen, one of the best people. He's just the nicest dude, the coolest dude, any girl he wants, any, you know, any move he wants to hit in competition, he hits it. Of course, I'm talking about Caio Saines. Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! What is Michael doing? What is what is Michael doing here, bro? I thought we got Caio. I thought we booked Caio. Speaker 3: I I for a sec was hoping the glaze was about me. I was I thought we were cool, Trey. I thought this was like I thought we're on good terms now, but I guess not. I guess we're not on good terms. Speaker 2: Trey was just momentarily number one in the rankings and then dropped back to Speaker 3: plummeted, dude. It was Speaker 2: No, no, hey, listen, uh, that's my bad, Michael. I'm I'm stoked you're on too. That's uh I mean, everything I had planned, you know, was for Caio, but I guess I guess we can roll with Michael. No, I'm kidding. We're friends, of course, now. We buried the hatchet, right? Speaker 3: No. Speaker 2: Oh, okay. All right. All right, so we're going to have a very hostile show for everybody. But obviously, we got Speaker 4: I heard you guys were best friends forever. Yeah. I heard friends forever. I heard Speaker 3: I was open. I was commenting under the post. I was hoping we'd be great friends, but I guess me and Trey are just, you know, forever being talking. Speaker 2: Some people going to fight forever. I feel I feel like it's better this way though, right? You know, it's like an athlete need somebody in the media to have a little tension with, to prove wrong or whatnot, you know, and and I'm trying to be like Stephen A. Smith soon, just saying outlandish stuff and getting, you know, huge paydays. Speaker 3: You have a misconception on us athletes though, you know? Sometimes I want to be tender and loved and cared for, dude. I don't want to be at war at all times, dude. I want to be Speaker 4: I got you. I got you, Michael. I got you. Speaker 2: I can be tender too. Speaker 3: Okay. No, no, no. We're we're good. Reese got me now. Speaker 2: All right. Well, obviously, you know, we're stoked to have Michael on with his nice curls, his little mustache and everything. He just won ADCC trials in incredible performance. You know, yeah, give it up for Michael. We're joking around about the Caio stuff, but we're obviously stoked you're on here and, you know, your performance was obviously incredible. I kind of felt like we saw like almost like a leveled up Michael Saines at this trials. Like, I don't know how you did it, but from East Coast to West Coast, it was just like even a different level that you hit there where you were just kind of suave the whole time, you know, you were you were like yawning whenever you were fist bumping guys to start the match. You were looking over the camera like, I don't know. Just tapped another one, but, you know, what did what did you think about your performance? Speaker 3: So, really, after the East Coast, I kind of like I went into like a month limbo. Like I was like kind of out of it. Like I felt like I couldn't really focus and I think I just needed like a break. I took like a little week hiatus, kind of just chilled, didn't really focus. And I think that break really kind of gave me like everything I needed and I kind of focused back up and I came into training and I was training hard, man. Like when Tristan and Chingy come here, I'll ask them, like, I was training like a savage. Like I was training hard every practice, Monday through Saturday, like non-stop and like giving 100% and focusing on a lot of the skills and a lot of things I messed up on at East Coast and I think I I think I I showed it this weekend, really. Speaker 2: For sure. Yeah. No, you looked good the whole you have something else you're going to add? Speaker 3: I was going to say something too. And I and I think it was also the confidence I got from the East Coast as well, you know. I think the first time, you know, when I made it to the semis, when I made it to the finals, I was like so excited. It was like the first time I've ever done it. This time it was like, okay, I have to prove again that I'm going to do it. Like I can't just like come up short this time and, you know, get, you know, make it to the round of eight or just make it to the semis. Like I have to win it this time. Like people have expectations of me and I needed to deliver and I I did. Speaker 2: And do you do you kind of thrive under I I switched to backwards hat, Trey, by the way, while, you know, Speaker 3: I like that. Speaker 2: I like that. Speaker 3: It was lit. Speaker 2: Uh-huh. Did uh I guess like, you know, you're talking about like kind of there being that expectation of like needing to deliver this time and everything. But whenever whenever you watch Michael Saines compete, you know, whenever we watch you compete, you seem so like calm, so like unbothered by kind of like the gravity of the situation, you know. Obviously, trials is a big deal. It's a it's a gauntlet of a tournament. It's a hard thing. There's huge stakes being able to actually, you know, punch your ticket to the world championship and everything. Um, and that it just doesn't feel like you're bothered by that. So hearing you kind of say like, you know, that you're aware of those expectations and everything, I'm just kind of wondering like how you navigate that. Do you feel a lot of pressure in the moment? Like what is it being out there competing for such high stakes like that and how do you kind of stay cool throughout it? Speaker 3: I won't lie. Like I'm I'm very nervous. Like I think I I struggle with it. Like I actually got like very bad anxiety before I go compete. And like I want people to know that and I'm not afraid to admit that cuz I get super scared. Like before my finals match, I was nervous. Like I was like, even though I know I'm a great athlete. I have the skill set to win the match. I'm still like nervous. I'm scared. And like you just have to embrace it. And I I had watched I think I I think I had told Joe this. He had uh we're he interviewed me after the finals and he asked me and he was like, how do you deal with that? And I said, I had watched I saw a post on Instagram and it was about LeBron James, you know, imagine him 17 going into the NBA, literally fresh out of high school. Like youngest ever and people have expectations of him to be the greatest of all time. And one of the comments under the post said, expectation is a privilege. And I like I loved that and I was like, dude, that's so true. For people to have such high expectations, to people look up to you, to expect you to go out there and win a tournament, like that means you're on that level, dude. You must believe it. And some people let that kill them and some people let that build them. And I find the strength in me to believe in everything, believe in my skill set and go out there and prove why I'm the best. Speaker 4: How about your uh, you know, you you've been so active, Michael, on like the ADCC open circuit, the whole Alpha Miami crew is all over the the ADCC open circuit, your brothers and everything like that. So it seems like you have like a a really, you know, good core group of people who you can kind of maybe lean on if you are feeling that anxiety and stuff like that. It seems like anyway from the outside looking in. But but how how important do you think it that ADCC open circuit is to kind of your success for people out there who are trying to win trials, who see you and in in the next cycle want to be want to be, you know, West Coast trials champion and stuff like that. Did the ADCC open really kind of like lay the groundwork for for a lot of that experience? Speaker 3: 100%, man. I I cannot like give enough credit to those opens because I think I've competed at maybe like 20 of them already. Like I'm like somewhere in like the 20s. I've done so many and the amount of matches I was able to get in that rule set. I probably have more match time in the ADCC rule set than veterans, like champs who've probably won it. Like I have that much more matches on them because I was literally competing every month, at least fighting seven times, which is basically a trials bracket. I was fighting seven times in one day, scrapping against good guys and it wasn't like people who are nobody. I was going against good guys. If you look through like my opens, I fought like top-level guys. Like I fought Carlos Enrique. Like I've fought in you could go through the whole list. I can't name them all off the top of my head, but I've gone through a lot of good guys. Win some, I lose some, but all those experiences, I told one of my teammates this at the trials. I was like, it really feels like an open. Like I feel like I'm at like an open right now. Like I don't feel like I'm at West Coast trials. And then I go back to 2024 West Coast. For me, that felt like West Coast trials. Like I was nervous. I was like, man, this is a really big tournament. Like I need to be ready. This time I kind of just felt like I was going to like a California open. Like it didn't really feel any different. Speaker 2: We were even talking kind of like after day one, you know, it's like, you know, we're tired, it's a long tournament and it's like you see people everybody's got ice on their knees, everybody's got a black eye and stuff. But we were looking back and we were like, man, you know who it seemed like just had like a a walk in the park of a day? Didn't seem didn't seem like Michael Saines even like broke a sweat on day one, to be honest. Like Michael Saines is is sleeping good tonight probably. Like it just you just kind of like had such a a quick run and like Trey said, you were like yawning and stuff like that. So it just seemed like you were just in your element. You like were exactly where you needed to be. Speaker 3: 100%. I cannot like you took the words out of my mouth. I really felt like in my I felt I felt comfortable. I felt like I've been here 100 times and I really made it a goal to like try to get in and out on day one, to kind of make like a statement to myself that like none of these guys are on my level. I'm better than all these guys. I need to go out there and show it. And once I once I submitted everybody going into day day two, I felt really good. I was like, man, I'm going to go in there. I was excited for my first match of day two, which was Liam. Unfortunately, he pulled out. But like besides that, like I was really all fired up going into day two, like ready to go out there and kill. Speaker 5: Michael, I uh I couldn't help but notice here you're talking about how comfortable you were, how uh relaxed you were. Uh, you know, we we've followed the Saines experience at some of these tournaments before, right? And it's always super intense. You guys are battling, your dad's in the corner and he's shouting instruction and getting wild. Uh, but it felt like they were super calm and confident with you as well. I remember at one point, Tristan was waiting for his decision against Reese, you know, but the match was over. Your match was starting with Jet, but your dad was like, no, Michael's got it, you know, he'll be fine. I'm going to stay here and wait for the decision. Can you talk a little bit about how calm your team was around you? Do you feel like they were feeding off of your calmness? Do you feel like you were taking uh uh uh signal from them and they were feeding you? Like what was the what was the relationship there? Speaker 3: So definitely it was me telling like more of me, right? I I told my dad and I I've told my dad for a long time and I've always told them like, you know, if it comes down to me and like one of the people from the gym or one of my other brothers, go coach them. Like I I'm I can handle myself. I'm confident in my ability. Obviously, when you have a coach there, it is better. They can always see things from an outside perspective. But I believe in my skill set and I'd rather my dad be in that moment with my brother Tristan than have to worry about coming over to me because that just adds another layer of stress into the to a whole thing. So it's like I they also believe in me and they believe in my skill set. They know I was the best guy in the bracket. Like they knew I can win this bracket with a coach, without a coach. But obviously, would I want my dad in the corner? 100%. But if not, it's fine. I'm going to go out there and I'm going to take care of business. Speaker 2: Do you have some do you have some Reed? You're giving me a look. Reed was Reed was eyeing me down over here. I thought he was going to jump me. Speaker 4: Good. Speaker 5: Michael, you were talking a little bit about your submissions on day one and obviously that continued well into day two. Would you consider where would you consider your leg locks among other guys in the division? Speaker 3: I I would say I'm pretty up there, man. I again, I try not to um use them as much. Like if I'm going to use them, I'll use them, but like I like try to stray away, but I have some really, really sneaky leg locks. I'm pretty sure, I'm not sure we could pull it up, but my third match of day one, I had like an entry that was like so sick and the finish was like even sicker. I was like, I was like, I posted. I was like, this is too dope. Like I would say I I rank up there pretty good. Like it was probably one of my weak points a couple years ago, but now I would probably say it's one of my most dominant positions. Oh, dang, look at this. Speaker 2: Is this is this the one uh you were talking about the entry here? Speaker 3: No, no, no. It was the third match. It was my last match. Speaker 2: This is your very first match. Yeah. Speaker 4: The the one that you kind of you kind of go into the uh you kind of go yeah, you go into the table a little bit. Speaker 3: That's the third. Yeah. Look at this. It was so sick, man. I was like, dude, I get I get an inside position. I come through. I'm kind of playing like this reverse like wedge false reap. I can't really like get the exact name. I don't know, but I play it a lot in the gym. I shoot behind sweep. Now, he stands up. As he stands up, I try to force rotation. So like I try to like go back one step, like a little bit. I try to force him to his hip to force him to like a cross ashi, but he wasn't falling. So I was like, okay, instead of me trying to force him, I'm going to bring myself in and go into like a shoe lace same side ashi and then you can play it. I caught myself through and I just started forcing outside. And then if you notice something I do with the outside heel hook, instead of me trying to go for like a traditional like normal like figure four grip or like just butterfly grip, I go into like a I go into like a I grab the heel with my cross hand and I pull it into my armpit. So that creates a lot of pressure. If you guys want like whenever you guys try it in practice, you'll see if you just pull by the heel, there's already a bunch of pressure on the knee. And then what I do with my secondary hand, I use it to like support this and I just pull through. You'll see the moment he rotates and lands on his hip here, it was over. There was too much pressure. Speaker 2: That was sick. Speaker 4: What's this face for? What's that face? Speaker 3: Because okay, look, no offense to those guys, but like they were stalling on me. Like they were stalling crazy, dude. Like I had to like I was getting like not that I get frustrated, but I'm like, come on, dude. Like come on, like fight me, bro. Like don't don't be scared to get the second guy submitted. Bro, that guy was stalling so bad. I was like petting him on his head, giving him a hug, rubbing his back. Speaker 2: Oh, you're in closed guard, right? Speaker 3: Yeah, when I was in closed guard, I was like petting him on the back, touching his hair cuz he was like Speaker 2: I would stall against you too. Yeah, I'm blaming him. I'm going to stall you out and I'm going to take you down OT, get the dubski. Speaker 4: Yeah, I just pulled I just I just pulled the submission on this one slack, but this earlier in the match, he was he I do remember that, but this is the submission from that match right here. Speaker 2: Yeah, let's just let's just run we have like a three-minute highlight of your of your run here. Let's just run it from the top and maybe Michael, you can kind of talk us through some of it as it goes and we can look back at your little run here. Were you intimidated at all by this guy wearing Valetudo shorts? Speaker 3: Dude, I'm not going to lie. I was like, dude. But again, like here, like I knew guys, I'm not going to lie though. I destroyed his knee. His knee like, bro, his knee like Speaker 2: Is that why you're making that face right there? Speaker 4: I feel like you popped everybody's stuff. Speaker 3: Dude, oh yeah, and then Ernesto, I broke Ernesto's foot or like I at least I I hyper extended that foot. That was bad. This guy was stalling bad. This was bad right here. Speaker 2: That arm bar was sick though. Speaker 4: Another face. Speaker 3: That was. You love making faces after you submit a guy. That's my favorite, dude. I'm so like I like to notch a lot, dude. I like to just be like no care in the world, dude. Speaker 2: Yeah, going into any of these matches, did you have any guy that you kind of pegged as like, all right, this one's going to be a tough match or were you just confident the whole way through? Speaker 3: I was I knew I was going to submit all of them, but like I saw this guy, his name I'm pretty sure his name was Robert. Like Speaker 2: I'll be with him. Speaker 3: Robert, yeah, Bobby Winters, sorry. I saw I saw him. He looked physical. He looked tough. So I was like, okay, um, I was like, let me kind of like be a little bit smarter. He might try to disengage a bit. But I didn't really feel like too nervous. Ernesto, I knew I was going to sub him again. Like I I got this foot lock on him the last trials. And I didn't fully believe in it cuz I was like, I don't know, I just didn't believe in it. I was like, okay, I'm not going to waste my arms. But this time I said, I full sent it. Look at his foot. You'll see his foot like hyper extend here. Like look at it. You'll see it slip and just watch this. It's bad here. Speaker 2: It's already looks really bad. It's pretty nasty. It's pretty brutal. Tell him to wait. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's definitely a dangler there. He gave him the little the little break emote, huh? Little little Speaker 3: I don't know. Speaker 2: Do you do you find do you like talking to uh Owen Jones in the corner? I noticed you guys kind of tend to share barbs a little bit. Speaker 3: Me and me and Owen Jones are it's uh it's uh we got like little we just mess around. We we're very petty petty back and forth battle between me and him because me and him trained or we weren't training, but I'd asked him to warm me up at like the who's number one. And it got a bit like scrappy. It got a bit intense. It's been back and forth ever since then. And I and then he's good friends with Ernesto. So I submitted Ernesto at, you know, East Coast and then I subbed him again at West Coast. And we're always just banter back and forth with each other. Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember that at who's number one. It was during the uh absolute bracket and everyone just started running up to me being like, Owen Jones and Michael Saines just got into a fight in the warm-up mat. I was like, whoa, whoa. Is that for real? What's going on here? Give people people like to get dramatic about it. But I was like, are they seriously fighting? Then I went back there and there was an awkward an awkward vibe in the warm-up mat where I was like, oh shit, all right, I think something happened. Speaker 3: It got a bit chippy. It was getting chippy in the fight, you know, because it it started as like a warm-up and then it became like a like a full-on scrap and then it got it got a little bit heated. And then I'm like I'm the chillest guy ever. And Owen's a chill guy too, but it got it got a bit intense. Speaker 2: Yeah, but I I mean, I definitely think you're a chill guy too, to be honest. And Owen Speaker 4: He's not the chillest guy ever. Speaker 2: But no, I was just going to say, I would say with both you and Owen, and like I would put myself in this category too. I think that's why it's, you know, me and you like to go back and forth a little bit is cuz like I do like I like the shit talking aspect of sports. I think that's a very fun side. I know Owen does too. It kind of feels like you do as well where it's like, okay, if someone's going to engage in some shit talking, you know, going back and forth, I'm down. Is that do you kind of do you actually enjoy that side of it, you know? Speaker 3: Uh, I I I really do. It's fun. I try to stray away from it most of the time because like especially before a match. Like whatever, maybe like at a press conference or who's number one, I don't mind, you know, talking some shit. But the day of or during, I don't like to. I like to be a little bit more focused on what we're here to do, right? Which is compete. We're trying to again, what we have to realize is all these guys that are competing in these big brackets, trials, right? We all have the same goal. Everyone has the same goal. Everybody wants to go to Poland. If for whatever reason, I'm talking crap to you and I'm trying to start problems. The day of, it kind of just takes away the purpose of why we're there. You know what I mean? It adds like another layer of it and so I mean, I don't personally care enough for but some guys like Owen personally love to do it. Like that's like they live and die by that. There's nothing wrong with that. But just not my thing. I don't mind fucking around, talking crap to you beforehand and then even afterwards, but like doesn't really matter during the match. Speaker 2: Not in the midst of the match. That's a good cat. Yeah. Speaker 4: Yeah, we talk a little bit in the midst of the match too, but Speaker 3: I like to just be like rough. Like I'm not sure I it was with Jet. Against Jet, I was like full on like head butting Jet and like just bombing him to the face. I was being like physical. Even against Max, I was like Speaker 2: Yeah, I was going to say the finals had plenty of that too. Speaker 3: I was covering his face, shoving him to the mat. Like I was just I I tried to prove a point. I was just like, guys are good, but I'm going to be mean. I'm going to be physical. I'm going to use my jujitsu in literally every aspect. And I think that was also what I was really happy about too. My wrestling. I showed my leg locks. I showed my passing. Like I showed my guard play. Like I kind of showed everything. I felt like the last trials, I was a bit more bottom oriented. I felt like I was a little bit more focused on playing guard. And yeah, it got me the win into the finals, but I wanted to kind of open up, you know, my area of attack and I was glad to show it this weekend. Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you definitely showed a very complete game. Overall, you looked incredible the whole run. Um, another thing I want to I want to talk to you about is I want to talk about the Saines family just in general, you know, because I think you guys are you the Saines family is like they're rising as one of my favorite families in jujitsu, you know. You guys first of all, you have even more brothers than I realized. So I Speaker 4: Plus Chingy and Tristan. Speaker 2: Yeah, we got to get Chingy and Tristan in here. If they're Speaker 3: All right. When they Speaker 2: All right. When they when he was looking at me while I was talking, he was like, Yeah, yeah, no, bring him on. Dude, boys, this is big. I'm nervous. I'm shaking in my boots. I believe that Caio Saines is going to be joining the show here soon. I'm going to I'm going to try to find something to say. Speaker 4: The idea we could get this without going through his lawyers. Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, this is this is nuts. If if we get Caio on. Speaker 4: I tried to dab up Caio Saines at trials and he denied me. Speaker 2: That's right. He's been activated. Speaker 4: That shows that shows where I I sit in Caio Saines. Speaker 2: You haven't earned it yet, brother. Oh, let's there he is. Let's go. Hey, give us a flex down real quick, Caio. Give us the flex down. Oh my God. That's what peak athlete looks like. Michael, take notes. Hit the hit the gym. What's up, Caio? What are you up to, Caio? Speaker 6: Me? I'm just chilling. Nice. Waiting for my Speaker 2: Hey, Caio, I just wanted to say it was really nice of you to show Michael all those moves he hit at trials, man. It obviously like helped. Speaker 6: I know. I know. I had to teach him a little bit. He lost the last one in finals. I had to teach him a little bit in that final match. Speaker 2: Yeah, 100%. Speaker 3: I mean, you guys need to understand is in like this household, like no one mom, come here. Come here, mom. Speaker 2: We're getting the whole family on. Speaker 4: Gabby Saines. Let's go. Legend. Legend. Speaker 2: Clap it up for Mama Saines. Yeah. Speaker 3: Something about this family is no matter what happens, if you lose from my to not safe. You'll never I still hear but luckily I won this. But before I won this trials, I was hearing about that finals loss for like ever. Speaker 7: Every day. Speaker 3: Every day. Speaker 7: Every day. Speaker 3: Every day I heard about my loss. Speaker 2: Who who who's the one bringing it up? Everybody from top to bottom, all the way from Corbin down to Caio. Speaker 4: Who are you hanging with? Speaker 3: Mostly my mom. She's like, my you're my favorite second place son ever. Bro, that's Speaker 2: Hey, I got I got a question for uh for Mama Saines if she wants to come back on real quick. Cuz I'm curious, you know, whenever the mats the mats are one thing, you know. But whenever you got all these boys, I'm sure you got a rowdy crew, you know, for family dinner and all that. Whenever they start scrapping it out back in like the back room or something, who's really winning these fights amongst the Saines brothers? It's got to be Caio, right? Like Speaker 6: We know that. Speaker 2: We got we got Chingy and Tristan coming on now. Speaker 4: Tristan. Speaker 3: What's up? What's up, Tristan? Speaker 2: What's up, Tristan? Speaker 4: The best podcast we've ever done. Speaker 3: I I had to actually I I went on a food run for the champ, you know. He he said double chicken. I complain. You know what I mean? Speaker 2: Did you get Michael anything? That's what you got for Caio, but uh Speaker 3: No, you guys are clowning on Michael. Speaker 4: You guys are clowning on Michael. Michael's the best, man. Michael's the best, you know. Speaker 3: Michael's the best one. Like what are you Speaker 4: playing playing with us on the phone, playing on my phone right now. Speaker 3: Yeah, this is great. Reed's number one. Trey's middle. Joe's number zero right now. Speaker 2: I plummeted. I plummeted. Speaker 3: Fair enough. I heard that. I heard that. I'll level it back. Speaker 2: Hey, is is Caio still right next to you? Speaker 6: Sorry, he's in front of me. Speaker 2: Hey, Caio, did you did you hear the podcast where I activated you? To take out to Speaker 6: Yes, I did that one. Speaker 2: Okay. So I I was this is just between me and Caio now if everybody else could tune out. So what's the plan? Do you do you think we should hey, hey, whoa, whoa, whoa. Do you think uh we should, you know, hit him high, hit him low, same time or like do you just want him one-v-one probably make it, you know, probably as fair as possible for Reed, but even that's a major disadvantage. What do you think? Speaker 6: Bro, I want one-v-one against Reed. Speaker 2: Okay. All right. Speaker 6: One-v-one. Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll set that up. Speaker 6: What? Speaker 2: How do you Speaker 6: What? One-v-one Reed? Look how big Reed is. Speaker 6: Bro, I will kill Reed. Speaker 2: Oh, man. Speaker 4: I got I got like 100 I got like 100 pounds on you though. Speaker 2: He's genuinely twice your size. I will Speaker 6: Bro, one gillion and it's over, bro. Speaker 2: One gillion. Oh, he's calling the gilly. Speaker 4: Letting you know beforehand too. Speaker 2: Yeah. Let's go, Caio. You're a beast, bro. You you're going to be at the youth championship, right? Speaker 6: Yeah. Speaker 2: Awesome. Nice. You know who was filming you at the first youth championship, right? Have you seen the picture of me and you on stage? I'll send it to you. It was me. It was me filming you. I've been there since day one. Speaker 6: I didn't know. This guy was showing me pictures about him glazing you forever ago, bro. Like it's so bad, bro. Speaker 2: 100%. Yeah. Speaker 4: I would do the same. Speaker 2: Yeah. Get out of here. Get out of here. You're the man, Caio. You're the man, Caio. Thanks for joining in. Michael, what what is it like growing up as a Saines though? Is it is it wild having all these brothers? Cuz you have like, how many brothers do you have? You have Tristan, Chingy, Caio, Corbin, and then Michael one, right? You have five brothers plus you, so it's got to be crazy. Speaker 3: It it's um it's it's interesting, especially when like majority of us were living in the house, you know, Corbin and Michael now are, you know, they they do their own thing. But when everybody was in the house, it was like absolute mayhem. Imagine like there's always a fight going on, whether it be for food, whether it be cuz we're just upset at each other. It's just always mayhem. And when my brother Corbin, Corbin was really like if I have to give anyone a shout out. Obviously, my brother Tristan, but Corbin, Corbin was the one who got me like toughest nails, dude. Because Corbin is seven years older than me. So Corbin is 27 or yeah, he's he's seven years older than me. He's turning 27. So Corbin was seven years older than me. So when I was like 12, he was 19. And I would train with Corbin and I Corbin would kick my ass. Like beat me the bricks off of me. And I would want to kill Corbin. Like I wanted to I actually kill him. Like I hated him. He didn't with all my guts. So like as I got older, like 14, I got close to submitting him one time. I remember I was like, I wanted to break his arm. It was an arm bar. I wanted to break his arm so bad. And he ends up escaping and he like, bro, he mauled me. He mauled me for like the rest of that round, like killed me. And then as I started getting older, like 16, me and him became cool. And we became chill. And now we're like best friends. But before that, like we hated each other. Like I wanted to kill him, he wanted to kill me. And that's what got me so tough because I just wanted to kick his ass. Like just him. Nobody else. And like the same thing with the little ones. It's like, you know, with Chingy. You know, me and kick Chingy's ass. So what do you think Chingy wants to do? He wants to kill you. And like Yeah, he wants to like murder me. And same thing with like Tristan. Like I kicked Tristan's butt. So Tristan wants to come in and rip my head off. And it's just like, right now, by the way, just so you guys know, I am the top of the food chain right now. But Of course. Tristan, Corbin, they they can fight for that two, three spot. Chingy and then Boondy. Boondy's last, bro. I hate to break it to you, Trey. Speaker 2: That's just like it's just so inaccurate. Speaker 3: Bro. I mean, everyone watching, everyone knows that that that Boondy is top tier. Speaker 2: If we if we did a tier list of the Saines, every what would your dad say? What would your dad say who's the best? Speaker 3: It's obviously biased towards Caio. There's not even fair. Like it's not even Speaker 2: Okay, so now we're getting That's what that's one of my favorite parts about, you know, doing this bit about uh always promoting Caio and stuff is that your dad's just 100% on board. He's like, yeah, no, he's the best. Speaker 3: And he agrees wholeheartedly. It's not like he's like playing a game. Like he's very for real about it. Like he's very serious. Speaker 4: Caio's my favorite son. My best son ever. Speaker 3: Bro, I just want to say, bro. Uh, whenever like, do you find with so many brothers and stuff, do you guys uh, do you find yourselves in different roles amongst the brothers, you know? Is one of you more the peacekeeper? Is one of you like the quickest to, you know, chuck a little nuck and just like make it an actual fight? Like who I guess who's who's the first to actually go to like now we're fighting for real. Speaker 2: And we got to get we got to figure this out, yeah. Speaker 3: Tristan, come here. Tristan, come here. Tristan's got to be the peacekeeper. Speaker 2: I would have guessed Tristan peacekeeper. Speaker 3: I'm the peacekeeper. Speaker 2: No, he's not. Are you serious? Speaker 3: The one who causes war and it's every time. It's Boondy. Boondy is mayhem. Speaker 2: Oh my God. Okay. Okay. Speaker 3: Yo, we're playing basketball. We we have a we have a basketball hoop. We're playing basketball. Let's say you score on Boondy, you start talking a little bit of crap. Bro, he I've seen him punch Chingy like 20 times. I swear. I swear. Been knocked out like 20 times from them playing basketball. It's absurd. Speaker 2: Pretty awesome. Speaker 3: It's but it's kind of funny cuz we're split up in like twos, right? Me and Tris, you know, it was always kind of just me and him and then Tris, I mean, Chingy and Boondy are closer in age. So like they're like kind of like we're like duos, right? When me and Tris would fight, it was like, whatever, we would fight. We wouldn't tell my dad. No. We wouldn't we wouldn't tell my dad. We would get into like straight fist fights, scrap with each other. Not a word was said to my dad. Boondy and Chingy, they fight and I swear they're going straight to my dad. And then you know what happens? My dad gets upset at both of them. It's like they're like they don't know how to play the game. Speaker 2: They're not finishing the job. Speaker 3: Yeah. He takes a pool cue in half and says, figure it out like real men. Bro. No, you have no idea, bro. Speaker 2: Who is uh when it comes down to it, is Papa Saines the one who's actually whooping all you guys? On the mats. Speaker 4: Yeah, add an asterisk on that, by the way. Speaker 3: Unk Unk is not doing anything to me. I'm sorry. Speaker 2: Oh, man. Oh, man. Speaker 3: I feel bad for him. Speaker 2: Michael, how long Speaker 3: Go ahead. Speaker 2: Go ahead. Speaker 3: Go ahead. What are you going to say? What are you going to say? Speaker 2: I was just going to kind of say how how long have you been training jujitsu? When did when did you guys start this stuff? Speaker 3: So it's a funny story. So my brother Corbin, he was the one who initially got, you know, my dad into jujitsu and he was like, I want to do some sort of martial arts, some sort of like self-defense. And he started with jujitsu. And Corbin trained for like a year before any of us trained. And then Corbin eventually got he he Corbin stopped training. And then Tristan and me started training. We started training together. And I bro, to be honest with you guys, I hated it. Speaker 2: How old were you? Speaker 3: I was four. Tristan was three. Speaker 2: Oh, wow. Speaker 3: But like I despised jujitsu. Like for the first like six years, seven years of my life. Oh Lord, I can't believe I said that, but for the first six or seven years of my jujitsu, like I hated it. I could not stand the sport. I didn't want to do it. I would sleep on the mat. Tris was the one who was like the savage. Like Tris was like an arm bar wizard at the time. Like I swear Tris arm barred everybody. I was like doing wall sits on the wall half the time. I could care less about jujitsu. And my dad was like, listen, you guys, you guys can quit when you get your black belt. That's the thing. You started it, you're going to finish it. And that's what he told us. And I was just like, I was like, dude, I don't want to do this. And it kind of switched for me when I I went to a man, I forget if it was like a new breed or a Naga. I forget what tournament it was. But I went to go compete and I was competing for a belt. I was fighting for like a Naga belt. It was like an advanced division. And I made it to the finals and I ended up getting Kimora by this kid. And I got like I could not believe it. I was like so close to winning that belt. And ever since that day, like a switch changed in me and I just like started caring so much about jujitsu and look at where we now, you know, we're freaking Speaker 2: Yeah. That's what I that's what I wanted to ask, man. It's been a 15-year plus journey for you, you know, tons of I'm sure ups and downs, hard times. Uh, you know, it's a whole family affair. You got the whole family with you and you go out there and you kind of do what you said you were going to do and you achieved your your dreams of of winning ADCC West Coast trials and I'm just kind of like wondering for people, obviously, there was 200 people in your bracket that were trying to do the exact same thing. They didn't get to experience that like. Can you bring us back to that moment when the ref kind of raised your hand and and and gave you the gave you the win and and you're going to Poland and and, you know, kind of things are wide open for you now. Like just what what is that experience? What has this journey been like for you then to to kind of really stamp stamp that uh that win on on Sunday night? Speaker 3: It's man, it was like I for the first like five minutes after I won, really, I was like I I didn't even believe it. Like I was kind of just like, you know, you're kind of so out of it. And man, like to get my hand raised that night and I was I just wow, it was the most relieving thing. I was like, I was talking to my brothers yesterday about it. We're at the house and I was just talking to them. I was like, you know, I've dreamed about this night since I was 14. Fighting different opponents, different submissions, different ways of victory. Like I've dreamt about this moment over and over and over again. Like repeatedly and for it to be true now, it's man, it is such an honor and I'm guys, I'm not going to lie. It's a really great feeling and I recommend anybody who believes they can do it or they want to do it to full commit to that dream because I promise you, it is the best feeling ever. And just a couple years ago, I felt like I was outside looking in. Like I thought I would never accomplish something like this or be sponsored by, you know, level black or anything like that. Like I truly never thought. And if you just keep working hard and you just train and train and train and believe in your abilities, believe in the people around you, opportunity will come. You know what I mean? You just have to full send that. Speaker 2: I mean, how incredible is is ADCC, you know? ADCC is the best. Just like what what a way to do. You know, there's there's a lot of different ways out there these days, right? To kind of get where you want to go, to get to the to the top of the sport, to like you can become an influencer, you can become a creator, you can, you know, there there's many different avenues of kind of getting to the top of the sport these days, you know, and more and more people are kind of finding different avenues to kind of, you know, make a living from the sport and stuff like that. But there's still a way that you can change your life and you don't have to rely on anybody else. You can go out there and take the respect. You can go out there and and and earn the gold medal. You can earn the the clout and you can earn all the all that stuff. And and that way is through ADCC. So congrats to you, Michael, for for still kind of doing it like that and and taking what what's yours and not letting anybody kind of stand in your way. Speaker 3: Thank you so much. It it's it's true, man. It really is true. It's been a lot of hard work. You know, my first ever trials, I was 14. Or I was about to turn 15. I was like 14, I was about to turn 15. And my first ever trials and I made it to the round of 32 and I lost to John Calistein. And I was like telling I was telling my mom, I was like, I want to do ADCC. I want to be an ADCC world champ. I want to win the trials. And it's funny because after East Coast, after I lost, I go to I go to the airport. It was back when I was in Atlantic City. And I'm there and Mo happens to be on the same flight as me back. So I go up to Mo and me, we're talking to Mo and I was like one of the only like I think I was the youngest kid competing at the trials. So Mo's talking to us and stuff and I told him, I was like, I promise you, like, I'm going to win the trials one day. Like I'm going to win it. And after I had won, I go up to Mo and I was like, I told you. Like I told you I was going to do it. All those years ago, when I was like 14, I told you I was going to win this trials. And it was such like a such an amazing feeling. And he you know, he kind of he looks at me, he's like, he's like, you're in the big leagues now, bro. Like you you put your name on it. You stamped it and it's true, man. It's such an unreal feeling. Speaker 2: Yeah, that's incredible. You know, getting to see somebody realize their dreams like that. It's probably one of the best part of our job, to be honest. Like someone who deserves it and is able to actually accomplish it and all that. So, obviously, big congrats to you, Michael. I will say we we said we're going to talk about Donk Toss. So I wanted to I wanted to show you something cuz I know you've you've played around with Donk Toss, but we actually have the the producer of this show, he runs the actual Donk Toss league that gets aired on ESPN. And so we're going to pull up some highlights because they just did their uh qualifying bracket and everything. I'm going to make a push for for getting you involved next year. Whenever they compete. So this is the actual competition Donk Toss. This is Christian Piles. He's a uh a flow wrestling guy. Speaker 3: Flow wrestling, yeah. Speaker 2: Yep. And he competed. Look at that. Speaker 4: Wow, what a shot. What a shot. Speaker 2: It's not bad, huh? You didn't you didn't know when we brought the Donk down to Miami that it was actually this big of a thing, huh? Speaker 3: This is this is serious. You think what do you think you would fair in the competition like this? Speaker 2: You think what do you think you would fair in the competition like this? Speaker 3: Nah, bro. I'm I'm I'm sorry, but I'm schooling the comp. Did they not see me at who's number one 25 uh like the one in Miami? Did they not see me? Speaker 2: They might not have. They should have been watching. They should have been watching. That was that was legendary that day. Speaker 4: We're going to get a sponsorship going. Speaker 2: Yeah. Speaker 3: I have to. Speaker 2: Hey, Nikki, Nikki the producer, what do you think what would it take to get Michael Saines sponsored by Donk Toss? He'll put it on his kit. Speaker 3: Oh my God. I'll Speaker 2: He says he's got you. He says he's got you. Speaker 3: I'm in. I'm in then. Let's do it. Speaker 2: We could get this we could get this going down at Alpha Miami Grappling, do a full stream of it down there, you know. I don't know. Just just saying. I'm on my manager shit for you right now, Michael. Let me let let me get somebody on the horn. Speaker 3: We got that. You're you're you'll be running my management now for you'll be my manager. Damn, look at that. That was perfect technique too. Speaker 2: You think you think you got it better than that though? Speaker 3: Yeah, they don't really understand how they need to be moving their elbows. Like look at the elbows are flared out right now. That's not how to throw it. That's you know, we're we're getting rid of force. We need to keep our elbows tight to our body, keep it more controlled and more in a center line. Speaker 2: For sure. So around this time next year, you know, if you're not doing anything, we'll we'll push to get you uh involved in this bad boy. Would you be willing to choke somebody out if you lose? Speaker 3: Bro, is that even a question? Speaker 2: I'll choke them all out if I win. Speaker 4: Oh, CP blew it on that one. Speaker 2: He knows it. He knows it. Michael, I I obviously a lot of a lot of crazy action from from the weekend there. Did anybody else kind of catch your eye as like fun to watch or you were hyped on? Speaker 3: My Cuban brethren, Nathan Haddad. Dude, what a freaking dude, that guy I I first met him in EBI. I I fought on EBI and I met him there and he comes up to me and my dad, we're talking. He's like, I'm Cuban. I'm like, bro, I'm Cuban too. What? It's like, we're like a rare breed. You don't really see us in these type of sports. So I was like, for him to go out there this weekend and just kill it was awesome, dude. I was so freaking like I was so happy about that. That was such a cool um such a cool run he had. Another person, let me think. Who was the girl that won 55? Man, her passing was Speaker 2: Shelea Lindsay. Speaker 3: Shelea Lindsay. Wow. Man, her passing on the right side was next level. I was genuinely super impressed with her. Like she took everyone's back. Speaker 4: Everyone's back and just five rear naked chokes, I think. Six matches, five rear naked chokes. Speaker 3: Dude, that is like absurd. She killed it. Um, who else? Who else? Who else? Trying to think. Trying to think. Speaker 4: Page, you got Sarah, you got Elder, you got Nick Hartman. Speaker 3: Nick Hartman, man. Nick Hartman. Shout out to Nick Hartman, man. Shout out to Nick Hartman. He really, really crushed it, man. I was so happy for him. Especially, you know, with the with the post you guys made on him for his daughter. That's man, like no one more deserving, really. No one more deserving. Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure. He made a he made a lot of fans this weekend for sure. You know, really authentic dude who's out there putting it on the line. So that was great to see. Speaker 3: I I I met him at East Coast and I didn't really talk to him much, but man, after this one, how can you not be a fan, bro? That guy crushed it, bro. 100%. Speaker 2: Pretty cool. Yeah, always one of the coolest things is yeah, now we're going to see a guy like Nick Hartman in these brackets with guys like Felipe Pena and Luke Griffith and he's going to get his shot against the best guys in the world. But, you know, that also, you know, that comes back to you. You're going to get your shot against the best guys in the world. You're going to be in a bracket with a bunch of tough guys. One guy I actually wanted to ask you about while we have you. What do you think about a match up with you and Mika Galvao, the returning champion? Speaker 3: That's going to be that would be awesome. Again, I think Mika is extremely dangerous, right? No matter where a match goes, he can find a submission. I'm quite literally anywhere. And I would probably say he's one of the most well-rounded athletes in all of jujitsu, if not the most well-rounded. So, wherever that match goes, I expect it to be tough, right? Like I don't expect that to be an easy match in the slightest. But I'm going to be working a lot on negating a lot of the stuff he does and making sure that I'm able to put myself in a position where I can control the pace, right? Something that Mika does great is he's always kind of pushing forward. He's always the one attacking his mission. He's always he has the opponent always on a defensive cycle. And like someone like when he fought Wagner, Wagner was able to kind of negate most of his attacks until obviously the end. But I think if I keep that on my feet and I put a good pace on him, I think we can see me walking away with a dub there. Speaker 2: Definitely. I think there's a lot of exciting matches, you know, to be had at uh ADCC now, especially with with you being in the bracket and everything. Um, I know we started a little late, so I don't want to keep you too long, Michael. You got your Chipotle there and everything, but Speaker 3: I I really love it. Speaker 2: That's all right. Um, I just want to say, you know, thanks for coming on and everything. I know the the Saines family watches the show, so I'm glad we could get you on. And, you know, also like we make a lot of jokes and everything, but we really we really do love you, Michael, and we love the whole Saines family. You guys are incredible to watch, you know. We love watching you compete. I love how you'll come over and uh hang out with us, talk crap, you know, mess around and then go out there and and murder dudes on the mats. So, couldn't have couldn't have happened to a better guy and uh I'm glad you're going to be going to Poland, bro. Speaker 3: Hey, let let let me say one more thing. Hey, we need to get rid of like trying to be too cool for school. These guys think they're too cool to like, you know, talk for a little bit or you know, who cares, guys? Just talk, have fun, try to be joke full. If you make everything so serious, like that's like the worst thing ever. Like nobody likes a serious guy like that. Like really, nobody does. Like who wants to talk to like a boring serious guy? Yeah. I submitted him. That was fun. That was good. Bro, come on, bro. Just freaking go out there, have a good time, make laughs, joke with people and enjoy the moment, dude. Speaker 2: For sure, Michael. I think that's very good advice, to be honest. It's very true. Speaker 4: Could you give us a couple poses for the thumbnail? We're going to we got to make a thumbnail for the for this. Speaker 2: Yeah, make some crazy face. Speaker 4: Maybe maybe we can give some a couple good poses. Speaker 2: That's a pretty good pose. Do do like a really excited like Mr. B style face. Speaker 4: Yeah, a little more eye contact. Speaker 2: Oh, there we go. There we go. That one's good. That one's good. Now do do like a hands on the head like shocked. Like I can't believe I won. Yeah. That was perfect. All right, I'm going to use AI to make that some crazy stuff. It's going to have Caio Caio in the background flexing behind you and you making that face. Speaker 3: Michael Saines Chipotle order. Speaker 2: Go ahead. This should this should be. Speaker 3: Uh, we got white rice. We got black beans. Cuban, you know. Sure. We get double chicken. We get cheese. We get guac. We get sour cream. We get corn. Did I say lettuce? Not yet. Lettuce. Um, we get hot sauce. We call it there. That's perfect right there. Look at that. Speaker 2: All right. Double chicken and the guac. That is an ex they they living good down in Miami. Speaker 4: $40 Chipotle order. Speaker 3: Bro, that's 13 bucks, bro. Speaker 2: Okay, okay. Yeah. You ever go to Rangus Town after you eat that? Speaker 3: Rangus Town. Speaker 2: Yeah, Rangus is just hot brown rain. All right, Michael, on that note, we'll let you get out of here. Speaker 4: We'll see you in Poland, Michael. Hell yeah. We'll see you in Poland. Speaker 2: Thanks for joining, bro. Speaker 3: Hey, let let let me say one more thing. Hey, wait, before we go, before we go. Yo, we got we got to do a crazy vlog in Poland, dog. Speaker 2: Let's do it. Let's do it. Speaker 3: I got you. I'm going to be there like two weeks out. I don't know when you guys are going in. I'm going like two weeks out. Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going with you. Speaker 3: All right, ride with me. Come with me, Trey. Speaker 2: All right, perfect. All right, Michael. Thanks for calling in, man. Speaker 4: Appreciate it, brother. Speaker 3: Guys, take it easy. I love you guys. I'll see you guys in Poland. See you, bro. We're going to Poland. Let's go. Bye, guys. Speaker 2: All right, there we go. Michael Saines. And we got the Caio freaking podcast debut. We got the bump, you know. Yeah. Instead of, you know how like uh for college football when a team has enough wins to go to a bowl game, they say we're going bowling. They should we should for this ADCC say we're going polling. Speaker 4: Polling. That's good. That's good. Speaker 2: We're going polling. Yeah. Hopefully there's no hanging chads, am I right? For all of our political fans out there. Speaker 4: Can we talk a little bit about uh Nathan Haddad a little bit more? Speaker 2: For sure. Cuz yeah, Nathan Haddad's run was unbelievable. Yeah, yeah. Maybe we got I think we got a clip of uh Nathan Nathan's um semifinal match there um against uh what's his name? Jaden Groner. And he was having an incredible tournament as well here and uh but Jaden was, yeah. Jaden was as well. So both these guys kind of like, you know, on have crazy momentum and they go into this semifinal match. This might have been the best match of the entire tournament. Speaker 4: I don't think it's even maybe. I think it's definitely the best match of the tournament. Both these guys showed such incredible jujitsu. Both guys were, you know, put puttin' uh some really awesome offense together. Uh, a lot of no quit stuff from Nathan Haddad all weekend, even before this. Fought Dory, fought Placido. Uh, and yeah, here you see the back take and Jaden thought he had it all wrapped up. He's yelling at the corner, yelling at Eddie Bravo. It was nuts, man. Speaker 2: And who who was talking who was telling me about like like when when one person scores, like 99% of the time, the guy who first scores wins in ADCC match, right? Speaker 4: I was going back. I only found like two or three examples the entire tournament where somebody scored and lost. Yeah. Like if you score points, you almost always win in ADCC trials or worlds match. Yeah. And so this is the final kind of three minutes of the match here. And obviously, you know, right right here, Jaden is in full control, you know, as the time tick ticks down, kind of two minutes left here, something like that. And yeah, historically in ADCC matches, if you can put points on the board, most likely, 90% of the time, you're going to win cuz it's it's difficult to, you know, it's so hard to score. So hard to score points and, you know, the matches are short, only six minutes. There's only three minutes where you can score points. So it's it's a hard thing to do. Um, so at this point is cuz I know it was it was 6-0 whenever it goes to the end, but so he's up 6-0 right now. Speaker 2: Yeah, this I think it's going to be the end here pretty soon. Yeah, yeah. They sit here for for just uh 30 seconds or so, I think. Um, but six points, man. Like six to zero. That's a that's a huge deficit. Speaker 4: Absolutely, man. And yeah, Jaden, we saw him in PGF earlier this year. Uh, have a great run. It's kind of the first place he showed up on my radar. Uh, Nathan also PGF veteran, by the way. Uh, Nathan at East Coast trials was looking good until he ran into John Blanc, lost that one, came in with a, you know, a lot of confidence in himself, obviously. Uh, but Jaden's guard is looking super strong. Six nothing. I mean, you just never see guys up six nothing. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like as I'm filming this, I'm kind of thinking that, okay, Jaden's the guy here. He wins six nothing. He's going to win this match, you know. And obviously some crazy stuff happens right here. It's like when you see a scoreboard at ADCC trials and it's 6-0, you just kind of are like, oh, wow, dude, somebody's getting dominated. Yeah. It doesn't it's not generally a back and forth situation. It's like, oh, someone's getting owned out there, you know. But here comes a Hell Mary real quick. Uh uh Yeah, so now we're coming up on kind of like a minute left, basically. Time ticking down. He jumps on this arm. To the Kimora, to the arm bar, to everybody filming this match, wondering when the arm is going to explode. Here you see like one final little twist and turn to escape and he's just cranking. And right there whenever he taps, there's literally one second left on the clock. One second separated him from going to the finals and not, you know, both guys. Yeah. Um, but that's why you never quit and that's why, you know, ADCC is the perfect place to find out what you're made of. And, you know, we all know what Nathan Haddad is made of right now, you know. Nathan Nathan Haddad like he had that moment, obviously, he had a sick match with Placido earlier. I mean, he had another couple great matches. Doria Doria, he had a crazy match with. It was like for one, he had a crazy run, like of just like notable guys, like Placido, like Dory. But then also like other young hungry dudes like Jaden right there. And he was able to like face adversity, come through. But it was just like Nathan Haddad was the guy, like there's a lot of times at a bracket. I guess to compare him and Michael. Michael was like rolling in a way where it was like, holy shit, Michael is no one stopping. There's like an inevitability. Yeah, it's like this. He's he just hit that different level as soon as he took the mat the first time. For Nathan, it was like this snowball effect where it was like, I'm running over. I'm like, bro, Nathan Haddad and and Placido just had this crazy match and Nathan won. He's yelling at my camera. And then the next one, Joe's coming over. He's like, dude, you just had another insane match. This dude's the real deal. And it just kept kind of accumulating. And then finally, he gets in the finals against Ryan Aikin. Ryan Aikin looked like he was three times as big as Nathan Haddad. Like Corey at training last night was like, how big is Nathan Haddad? Is he like really, really small? Should he be doing 77? And I was like, honestly, he's a big dude. Like there's no way he could make 77. Ryan Aikin. Yeah, but Ryan Aikin, all these guys think they can 170. If you can't if you're not a heavyweight, you're pretty sure you can make 170. Every guy we talk to. But it's just like, I mean, yeah, he was the guy who kind of just kept rolling and gaining more and momentum and ended up like it was one. So does Ryan Aikin. Just Ryan Aikin. And then and then uh obviously it was one second that basically was the deciding moment between whether or not he didn't just win that match, but went on to win trials or not. And he was able to get it done. So I thought Nathan Haddad was probably the biggest breakout star of the event for me. I mean, it was incredible to watch him the whole way. I think that was the kind of run where if you pull him first round at ADCC, you're like, God, I'm really going to have to drive a stake through this guy's heart to get him to stop moving forward on me. It's very J-Rod-esque in a way, right? Where, you know, we saw him have that West Coast trials run uh uh once upon a time. West Coast trials, West Coast trials. Uh and it was very similar. Tons of submissions and, you know, kind of out of nowhere. Uh and this is the kind of stuff that ADCC trials are made of, you know. You don't have to have a certain number of points. You don't have to have a certain belt, right? You can just think you are the best and show up and prove it and beat a bunch of really, really tough guys. And that's what Nathan Haddad did. Now he's ranked, I think like 10th in the world or something, 195 pounds. He's earned it. Uh, you know, great, great win over uh Ryan Aikin there like we talked about in the finals. Ryan was rolling, doing really well. Submission after submission, especially on that second day. It looked like he was really gaining momentum. I mean, we all circled Ryan Aikin as kind of like the guy to beat in that division too, you know. And uh, you know, yeah, Ryan had a great tournament. But um, but definitely it was Nathan Haddad's, you know, weekend. Like just what an incredible breakout performance. Uh, you know, I think I think everybody's on everybody's radar now, you know, and and just a huge, huge moment for him. And and another guy who I know has been at it for for a long, long time. 26 years. He told me. 26 years. He started training uh like late 90s uh with one of the guys who won the first ever Black Belt World Championships. I wish I could remember the guy's name off the top of my head. I'm sorry, I don't. Uh, but like, yeah, so just from like a very early on place, he was uh uh drawing uh some really good coaching. Third out of four trials where we've had somebody from Kentucky win it, joining Brandon Reed and Jacob Couch. Pretty cool. Uh, I know he's also trained a little bit with the Pedigo guys. Obviously, anybody good Midwestern, probably going to have trained at least a little bit with those boys. Uh, yeah, unbelievable, man. How old is Nathan Haddad? Did he start training at negative three? He's like 29, 30. Like he started training like, yeah, basically out the womb. Yeah, well, I mean, what an absolute dog. That was sick to watch, you know. Uh, hopefully, I'm going to try and reach out to him. Hopefully, we can get him on soon cuz I want to talk to him about all that and everything and learn more about him. Um, another obviously impressive run was Sarah Galvao. I would say she was in the camp of like once she got going, it was like, all right, yep, Sarah's not going to be denied. Like Sarah's like, she looked so sharp. She kind of killed it the whole way through. I think we have some of her her final here. Slack is pulling up. Um, but yeah, Sarah decided to put her name in in into trials and kind of earn it that way, which is always respectable, you know, a cool thing for an athlete to do, not to rely on invites, especially when invites are probably more sparse than people realize. And uh, she got it done though. 100%. Sarah's trying to put together what may end up being the greatest rookie Black Belt year of all time. And uh, yeah, being a super Grand Slam champion is the goal and this is another step towards that. This is a step towards being a competitor and a contender out there in Poland. She already has matches against people like Helena, has a win against Anna Carolina. Uh, Sarah looked like, yeah, just a total terminator this entire tournament. Here's here against Judea, who's super tough and looked great making the finals. But, you know, number one pound for pound in the ghee and top 10, uh, I think pound for pound Nogi as well. Sarah's uh, just a uh, you know, on that next level right now. And shout out for Sarah for holding it down on the both kind of spectrum there, you know. It's like doing ghee and Nogi. That was a thing a while ago. Obviously, these days, you kind of don't see as much of these athletes kind of uh, making the that switch from from ghee to to Nogi and having one of the most, you know, toughest, technical ghee battles, you know, just a few weeks ago at Pans when she fought Gabby Passanya, you know, who is obviously way more kind of credentialed than Sarah Galvao, um, and maybe even on paper, you would say that she's way more technical in the ghee. And Sarah was able to beat her and then switch gears, take the the ghee off and prove that she's the best, you know, in North America without the ghee as well. So, that's just something that doesn't get done uh a lot these days and deserves like an extra special shout out for just holding down jujitsu, no matter what you're wearing. Love it. For sure. So, there's obviously a lot of trials champs to talk about. Um, you know, hopefully we'll keep kind of talking to more of these people and stuff as the weeks go on. Um, but I did want uh Michael Saines brought up Nick Hartman. I just I wanted to talk about Nick Hartman too because We do have a clip of Nick too of um just his submission in the final, but Okay, yeah. So, obviously, I mean, he had an incredible run. We've been big on Nick for a while now. It was kind of one of those guys that felt like eventually it was going to be his time. And also the thing that Michael kind of talked about where after he won, he kind of just immediately started talking to the camera and he kind of explained a deeper purpose behind this trials run and everything, you know. And I think a lot of times if at least for me, like it feels like, oh, what what are we even doing this for? Just for people to be really good at jujitsu, you know, to go out there and do submissions and post Instagram clips all the time, you know. And hearing him talk afterwards about uh like his goal was to win trials so that then he could basically have a platform to be able to talk about a situation that his daughter is dealing with where she lost her vision and her hearing, I believe. And he wanted to put that out there and like ask, you know, if people knew of doctors or hospitals where they can help her out and kind of help spread the word around that and potentially, you know, help her daughter live as normal of a life as she can. Like, that's an incredible thing. When when someone is like doing this for a bigger purpose, doing this for something that's like truly meaningful beyond sports, beyond any of this Instagram clout or internet beans, you know, and they're able to kind of like achieve that so then they can use it in that way. I just thought that was an incredible thing. So I kind of wanted to talk about that and, you know, go check our Instagram if you want to hear everything he had to say about it and stuff. And obviously, if you're in a situation where you know people who can help or you have ways to help Nick Hartman uh help him and his family, then like, obviously, that would be very meaningful, very impactful. But, you know, Nick Hartman, I was already a fan. He skyrocketed for me as like, that's incredible. When you realize a person is doing this for like a a reason bigger than themselves that like it just makes it so much more meaningful. So, I was super happy to see Nick get the win there and be able to kind of like do what he set out to do and be able to get a platform to talk about that stuff. So, it was very incredible. Nick's daughter's condition is called RTD type two. If you know any way of being able to help this, uh doctors, hospitals, things like that that he mentioned, please reach out to Nick, uh give him a shout. Yeah, just a very genuine guy and uh yeah, you know, like you said, some things are bigger than than the sport, some things are bigger than a gold medal. And this is that's what this is. And so, you know, I think truly that the jujitsu community is a special place when we can come together and and uh do things for other people and and I'm hoping that uh you know, the jujitsu community can can get behind a guy like Nick Hartman who just uh, you know, deserves the world and so does his daughter. So, uh yeah, share that clip if you can and and let's let's let's show Nick that the the jujitsu community kind of cares about him and and and we can help, you know, that's that's uh ultimately what we want to do here. Jujitsu can change the world and and that's why we're all here. We we love it and uh, you know, trying to do some good things sometimes too. Definitely. It it's really, you know, obviously, if you know, for Nick to come out with that at the end, uh amazing. Even leading up to that, I felt like he was showing so much more personality, right? And showing so much more of himself. We saw Nick. Uh after the quarters or the semifinals, maybe? Semis. Uh, yeah, and so you see even outside of that that he is, you know, becoming more of a confident guy. He's realizing that he does belong with these top guys. And when I talk about, you know, guys who are going to get their shot at being in a bracket with all the best guys in the world, it's super reasonable that he, you know, a young hungry guy like Nick Hartman is fighting there on day two at ADCC and making some crazy things happen, right? The way these brackets come out, the way these runs start, the way people gain momentum and Nick's such a dangerous submission threat. We've seen a lot more crazy things happen in Nick Hartman going to run. Definitely. And so, I guess just to run through some of the other trials champs real quick. Obviously, Page Vet Climber got the win there. So shout out Page. Uh tough finals against Elizabeth Mitrovich, but Page was able to get the win. We saw uh Shelea Shelea Lindsay. Obviously, we talked about her with Michael. Incredible run. Johnny Grippo getting it done. Another just great feel good story from from the weekend, you know, Johnny Grippo. We've all been fans of Johnny Grippo for for decades now, it feels like. And um, you know, obviously, a lot of young up and comers in this in this kind of 66-pound 66-kilo division. And uh you kind of forget sometimes about these kind of veterans and stuff when there's so many new names and and whatnot. But uh Johnny Grippo made sure to remind everybody that he ain't done and that he's coming to to to, you know, wreck shop in Poland. And this was an incredible final here. Everybody saying you can't go double outside ashi on Johnny and I guess it's true, huh? Fair enough. Yeah, the uh the fake rip era is over. Uh as we are seeing, uh somebody commented on Instagram and uh yeah, it's uh trying to go false reap on Johnny, trying to go outside ashi on Johnny. Uh you got to be so, so careful. He's so, so good. He's one of the best in the world at smashing leg entanglements and getting in pressure and on those. And then yeah, you see after he's ripping his stuff off, popping top, uh hugging with uh BSM. Should they both going to be in Poland together competing like that, right? Yeah. Should I say my actual favorite moment from the whole trials? Is that too inappropriate? Yeah, that's I don't know. No, I'll say it. I'll say it. Okay. No, I think you should say it. I think it's perfectly fine to say. We had a coaching snafu that we need to talk about. Yeah. So during the finals, Johnny versus Dom Mahia, pretty early on, um, Keevon is in the corner, you know, he's giving instruction. He's doing it kind of like uh ecological style where it's very concise, kind of shortening down the instruction to make it like Which I mean, like you got to give the shout out to to ecological jujitsu here, man. I think the guy the haters on ecological jujitsu, it's like it it's it's being proven at the highest level here. There there's something to it. I think. Yeah. And so basically, Keevon is coaching him and at one point he just goes, G, don't give him head. And I just thought that's really good advice. No matter what you do, G, don't do that. Do not do that during the middle of this match. Fight back against whatever instinct might be telling you. And I was like, wow, that is some of that is straight up the best advice I've ever heard. If that was on the table, if that was potentially something that could happen, then thank God he told him not to do it. No, honestly, I think they were like hand fighting in standing and stuff and he was saying like, he may like don't give him a collar tie. Yeah, don't don't let him have head control, you know, something like that. But he just said, G, don't give him head. And then he there's like a little pause there for a second. He just goes, I I I just I didn't mean to say like that. I didn't mean to say like that. People started like turning a little bit towards him like he had to address it. No, I I like was sitting right next to the corner when he said it and I just went, good advice. Literally good advice. I mean, I don't know what else to say. But that was a crazy final. Yeah, just like it was like last match of the day and I feel like there's something about like that last match of the day. Always the 66 final and just like, yeah, craziest the craziest stuff of the day sometimes happen. Yeah, so overall, it was all sick. Um, I don't really know how long we've been going, but do you guys want to dive into like some quick main character stuff or Brazileros or I guess not. Sorry. I brought it up, boys. Happy to talk about either. Uh, you know, I don't know how much time we got. It seems like a little bit over an hour. Uh uh Yeah, maybe we just do like a quick overview of it and then we can dive into it some more cuz Brazileros will still be going on whenever we film next week. Uh, it'll be kind of in the heat of it and everything. There we go. Main characters next weekend too, right? The Yeah. May 1st. So, main character, uh, there's two main characters coming up. Main character 900 games and main character uh invitational. And those are going down on Saturday, May 2nd and Sunday, May 3rd. Super stacked card. I think the headliner for the invitational is Nick Matea versus Marlon to Jick. So, obviously, that's a crazy match. Uh Amanda Bruce versus Jasmine Herrosha is going to be on there. Helena Cravar versus Kennedy Franklin. And a lot of other really sick matches. Johnny Grippo versus Reese La Fever is on that as well. So, you know, there's a bunch of cool stuff there. So, they're doing a whole week of like seminars and open mats. Um, maybe we'll try and get like Kamoy on next week. I need to talk to him as well. He was training at Paragon last night in the ghee. Nice. But I didn't talk to him much. Uh Reese is already getting messaged from our bosses saying Trey can't say stuff like that on the podcast. Already getting in trouble before this is even aired. But, um, and then Brazileros, Brazileros kicks off which day? Friday, the 24th here. Coming up on Friday. Yeah, we we kind of slow roll things. So, obviously, starting off white belts. So, this week, Friday, kind of white belts starts. We're getting into blue belts and whatnot. And then next weekend, uh same weekend as main character, that that May 2nd and 3rd is going to be the black belts. Hopefully, we're going to see, you know, what we're looking forward to is seeing uh Gabby Passanya versus Sarah Galvao round three. But, uh obviously, you got Pato down there and Tainin and uh, you know, a lot of the some of the best black belts in the world in Brazil. Uh unmatched energy. It's really an unmatched tournament to to be honest. It's much different than Euros and Pans and even worlds, to be honest. So, um, crazy tournament coming up. It's going to be a fun one to follow. Trey will be doing a bunch of kind of uh watch parties and stuff like that, I'm sure, right? Oh, yeah. I'll be watch partying it up. So, all the alley cats anonymous, you guys know where to meet me. Meet me in the mean streets of the internet world where we're going to be quad boxing until our freaking eyes start bleeding, dude. It's going to be a sick one. But, thank you guys for tuning into the Flow Grappling show. We'll kind of end it there. Make sure you guys tune in next week. Hopefully, we'll have some cool guests again and everything. We'll dive deeper into main character and Brazileros. You know, go go give Michael Saines some love. Give Nick Hartman some love. All these guys. And we'll see you guys in the next episode.